147: How To Perfect Your Pelvic Floor Exercise Routine w/ Isa Herrera

147: How To Perfect Your Pelvic Floor Exercise Routine w/ Isa Herrera

by Anna Cabeca May 26, 2019

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A staggering 30 million women worldwide suffer from pelvic pain, and it’s not only those who have had children. In fact, most women go without talking about their pelvic floor out of embarrassment and confusion. A proper pelvic floor exercise routine will help so many aspects of your life, from your sexual and anatomy health to your physical health and well-being

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Today’s guest is Isa Herrera, pelvic floor physical therapist, and we’re talking about everything you need to know about having a healthy pelvic floor. Isa first began her research into the pelvic floor after having a baby but also gaining a lot of pelvic pain and frustration. Her leaky bladder and feeling pressure and pain all the time led her back to her OB/GYN who just told her to do Kegel exercises.

But they didn’t work for Isa.

Kegel exercises. Most women have heard of them, but do you know how to do them properly? We move away from the term Kegel to talk about the over 25 different pelvic floor exercises to support female health. By learning how to connect with your body and your pelvic floor exercises, you’ll start to improve your problems, day by day.

We also talk about how important it is to educate our daughters about their anatomy and Isa gives a surprising example of her daughter’s classmate’s lack of knowledge. We need to empower and honor our pelvic floor health in a way our children can grasp and understand so they don’t have these problems or questions later in life.

Do you practice pelvic floor exercises every day? Are you in a constant state of compression? How do you talk to your children about their sexual health?

 

In This Episode:

  • What Kegels are, how to do them, and who they’re not good for
  • What a proper Kegel is and why you need to know about the other ways to do a pelvic floor exercise
  • How women should connect with the pelvic floor exercise
  • What strong pelvic floor muscles help with
  • How sitting incorrectly and for long periods of time can impact your pelvic floor muscles
  • What positions are the best to start doing pelvic floor exercises in
  • How to talk to your daughters about their anatomy and pelvic floor
  • Why vaginoplasty isn’t the answer to your pelvic floor health problems

 

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Quotes:

“All pelvic floor exercises, when it involves a contraction, have three things in common. The clitoris should nod, the area between anus and vagina should pucker, and the anus should wink. Those three parts should happen simultaneously. ” (7:32)

“If you can see it, then you can fix what’s not working.” (8:51)

“Before you can do a pelvic floor exercise, you’ve got to bring the mind-body connection to it.” (12:31)

“How do I go about this in a very holistic, honoring way for my child that she gets it, honors it, and knows that she can communicate and ask questions.” (21:01)

Links

The Ultimate Guide to Happier Lady Parts - Free Report

Find Isa Herrera, MSPT, CSCSOnline

Follow Isa onFacebook |Instagram |Twitter

 

Transcript

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Hello everyone, Dr. Anna here excited to be interviewing today, Isa Herrera, who is a pelvic floor expert. I have known her in this space for a long time, she really works to help educate women around the globe on improving our pelvic floor, especially in dealing with pelvic pain. So in our podcast today in Couch Talk, which as you know is an intimate place for intimate conversation, we discuss this, we discuss pelvic floor, pelvic pain and just opening up the communication about our pelvic floor, and the right way to do a pelvic floor exercise, right way to do Kegel exercises and Kegel yoga, let's just call it Kegel yoga.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
It's important to understand that over 30 million women suffer with pelvic pain around the world and it's a huge issue that's not well addressed, treated and discussed in so many of our clinic visits and our healthcare. Isa is a licensed pelvic floor physical therapist with this expertise and she is also the author of several books on the topic of pelvic floor dysfunction and pain, including her newly released international best seller called Female Pelvic Alchemy. She has focused on pelvic pain out of pregnancy and inside of pregnancy, so to help a wide range of women that are dealing with it throughout her life. Her gift to our audience today is the Kegel Blueprint gift and that's available at pelvicpainrelief.com/dranna, and I encourage you to take a look at that. Enjoy our discussion today, and please always post your comments and share with our audience.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Hello everyone, Dr. Anna here. Today I am with my guest, Isa Herrera and we are going to be talking about pelvic health. You know, because it is such an important topic and obviously it's something that both Isa and I are passionate about, empowering other women, because honestly, the rest of our life, the most important stage of our life, we want that quality where we have that freedom, we have tremendous ability to enjoy and reap what we have sown all these years and decades. Pelvic health is an essential part of that component. So Isa, it's great to have you here with my audience, thank you.

Isa Herrera:
Oh, thank you, Dr. Cabeca. I am so excited to be talking about this topic. As you know, this is a topic that's so close to my heart and I just want to go and dig in and just let it roll.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Excellent, excellent, perfect. Well, share with me a little bit and share with our audience a little bit about your background and what's created your passion in pelvic health.

Isa Herrera:
Oh, well thank you for asking me about that. You know, I went to PT school and when I was in PT school, I was pregnant. Now, I learned nothing about pelvic health in PT school. And after I had my baby, my pelvic health went to shred, as many women experience in this country and other places around the world and I had no idea how to help myself. I actually didn't even know what was going on. I kept going to my OB-GYN and saying, "Hey listen. I'm leaking. I have pressure. There's pain," and he would keep telling me, "Everything down there looks good." From the outside, everything looked good. Just the inside was a complete and utter mess.

Isa Herrera:
So I went home like a regular person and I did my Kegels like he instructed me to do and the more Kegels I did, the more pain I had. The more pain I had, the more leaking I had. I said, "I am not the only woman in this universe who is suffering from this." Then I started doing my research because I'm a big scientist at heart and then I realized that 30 million women in the US alone suffer from chronic pelvic pain. Over 49% of older women have either prolapse or incontinence, so once I started doing the research I'm like, wow, this is it, this is my life's calling. I've always wanted to work with women. I always knew I was going to be a healer from the age of three. I come from a family of healers, but I didn't know my direction. I was doing shoulders and working with the neck and doing sports orthopedics. And then when I had my baby ... You know, they say when something bad happens, you have to find the light in the dark. Well, that's what happened. I found this beautiful light and then it became my life's mission. I've written four books on the topic, I have all these courses on it and programs. So, I am so excited to be here with you today.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Well, I am glad to be here because we've talked before and we've discussed pelvic health and just different things that can really tweak and improve sexual health and sexual function and why that's so important for us, especially in this day and age, and why it's really important that we open the conversation because it's been so closed mouth. So let's talk about Kegels because pelvic floor exercises are so important but they're not good for everyone and we have to do them correctly. So, let's talk about that and the Kegel controversy.

Isa Herrera:
Okay. I do want to talk about the Kegel controversy because this is something that is really dear to my heart. As I said, after I had my baby, I was a good patient. I went home and I did my Kegels as instructed. First of all, not only was I doing the Kegels wrong when I look back at everything that I did, but it wasn't even the right prescription for me, right? Because in the beginning when we are dealing with pelvic health, we always have to create balance, supplements, and flexibility because if you don't have those three elements, it's going to be very difficult for you to attain pelvic power. So you want to contract something, something has to be flexible and have good coronation in order for you to contract it to help you gain this power so you're not leaking, your symptoms reduce, and your sexual function is better. So, I didn't know what the hell I was doing.

Isa Herrera:
I did my research and then in my practice in New York City, what I discovered was that the majority of women were doing Kegels incorrectly. What I'm going to do ... If you want me to discuss what a proper Kegel is, I can do that too.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah. Yeah, definitely, it's something that I love. I'd love to know your rendition of because for me, it's real important, our breathing tied to our Kegel. So you know, one of the things that I share is a Kegel video and just kind of talking through how we need to conceptualize the right way to do the Kegel exercises and also when we don't need to do them, so share with me.

Isa Herrera:
Well, I'll bring up by model, too. Thank you, I'm going to ... That's an awesome question, I'm so glad you asked that question.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
It's important and-

Isa Herrera:
It really is.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
... [crosstalk 00:06:48] hear it and I just like to say pelvic floor, just as a side note, a little disclaimer, I prefer to say pelvic floor exercises than call them Kegels. Because, you know.

Isa Herrera:
Yeah. Named after a man, too. Not that I have any objections with that, but I wish they were called a different thing. So, pelvic floor exercises, just like when you're training any other muscle in the body, you have to have endurance, coronation, you have to work with the breath, you have to work with the positioning, you have to work with gravity, so it's a very complex issue. And in my programs, I teach over 10 different types of Kegels and in my personal arsenal, I have over 25 different types of Kegels and pelvic floor exercises because it's not going to work for everybody. There's nuances too, but all pelvic floor exercises when it involves a contraction, have three things in common and I'm going to bring out the models so hopefully, you can see it.

Isa Herrera:
When you do a pelvic floor exercise, I can never get this right because of my dyslexia, there's always a clitoral knot, so the clitoral [inaudible 00:07:49] knot. This area here, between the anus and the vagina, should go up and in like this.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yes.

Isa Herrera:
The anus should wink. So those three parts should happen simultaneously in a neutral pelvis with an exhalation breath, and what I'm going to do for your audience is I'm going to give you my beautiful Kegel blueprint gift, so I will have a link up there as soon as possible so you can get this because it explains so many nuances that I go into. But those three parts are really important, which is the [inaudible 00:08:26] knot, the perineal [inaudible 00:08:29] should go up and in, and the anus should wink. And most women-

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Not kiss face and wink, got you.

Isa Herrera:
Yes. Keep this in full you know? And I really believe that in order for women to connect to this pelvic floor exercise, they should be doing it with a mirror. It's the only way. Because you know, a picture paints a thousand words. I really believe that. If you can see it, then you can fix what's not working.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
It does help too, and just to feel it, you know, talk about putting two fingers inside the vagina but also just even on the perineal body between the vagina and the rectum. And many women, that's reduced. I like your model but too, post epimysiotomy, post child birth, sometimes it's a very thin line and that's where often we see vaginal irritation, vaginal infections, urinary infections, things like that, so really feeling that muscle in between, that is so incredibly important, to feel that muscle right in between, yep, right there, go in and up. Like that, how did you do it?

Isa Herrera:
I've treated over 14,000 women and the thing here is-

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
[crosstalk 00:09:36]

Isa Herrera:
... if it doesn't go up, if something is not going up, just like you said, if something happened during the birth or there's trauma or there's atrophic changes, then sometimes it can even be missing but sometimes this area has tremendous amounts of scar tissue.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah.

Isa Herrera:
So we have to work on the scar tissue first because that could be impeding this particular action of being ... of the perfect Kegel. Right?

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Well, and again, just improving this hammock of our pelvic floor so that it keeps us continent, helps decrease our risk of constipation or rectal prolapse, helps with bladder control, pelvic function. We're sitting on it all day. We're not designed to sit on it all day. That's one thing, so let's talk about that because that's such an important part of women's health that were not even conceptualizing. So I agree; first, look. Always look and see what you've got going on down there, right? Let's look at our pelvic floor. Let's look at our pelvic anatomy, get comfortable what our normal is. Don't compare with anyone else.

Isa Herrera:
Thank you.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Let's just take it here personally, like, okay, I accept the way I am right now, what can I do to just make a little tweak so I can feel even better, even more amazing, right? Let's talk about exercising that perineal body, that area, that muscle.

Isa Herrera:
First of all, I'm glad that you brought up the sitting thing. One of the big things that impedes pelvic power, pelvic strength, and pelvic coronation, and creates more stress in the pelvis is not sitting correctly and sitting for long periods of time, right? We're sitting ... Yeah, this whole setup for [inaudible 00:11:07]. If we're sacral sitting all day long, at the office, then in essence what we're doing is we're bringing this bone here, the coccyx bone and the pubic bone closer together and the muscles are in a constant state of contraction. They're shortening and then we're trying to do Kegels to a shortened muscle, or pelvic floor exercises, and they're not working. We're trying to figure out why they're not working. Well, they're not working because the body mechanics are off.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Well, let's explain that in another way too. Say for example if you were walking around like this all day.

Isa Herrera:
Yes, exactly.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Right? It's like walking around like this all day, that muscle's never stretching out, you're not getting the elasticity of it, so it's stuck.

Isa Herrera:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). So for women who have stuck pelvic floor muscles, I think the most important thing is to do deep breathing into the pelvic floor. Get the body mechanics right, do maybe some internal work on yourself, and then come back and do a pelvic training program, an up-training program. They call it up-training because everything is going up. Right?

Isa Herrera:
In the beginning of a Kegel program, body mechanics really counts sitting properly, sitting counts, not over sitting and mindfulness. Before you even do a pelvic floor exercise, you've got to bring the mind-body connection through, like, what's happening with your pelvis? What's happening with your muscles? Are you in a constant state of contraction? What do you feel? Do you feel excessive pressure when you're doing activities?

Isa Herrera:
For me, it's once you get the mechanics right, once you get the awareness and this mindfulness right, then you can start to do a Kegel program or pelvic health program, that's going to bring you the changes and what you're looking for. Because a lot of women, it fails them. They get disappointed. Sometimes they'll get unnecessary surgeries and I think it's because of the way these particular exercises are being explained.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
That's so good and I'm just thinking in my mind, its' like breathing deep into the pelvis to elongate and stretch those muscles in different positions, et cetera, and just conscientiously thinking about it, especially if you've been sitting for a while. It's like yoga for the pelvic floor, right? It's stretching and lengthening and so just breathing into the pelvis, letting it all stretch, and then feeling the dynamics of that flow.

Isa Herrera:
Yeah, and then once you can feel them and you have that awareness, then and only then do I even consider starting my patients on an up-training program. Because it's like building a beautiful home but you build it with straw instead of bricks and cement and then you wonder why the house didn't stay up. Right?

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Wow, great analogy. Yeah.

Isa Herrera:
This happens all the time. The women come to me so disappointed and then I feel so bad because it could've all been prevented with the proper education and the proper guidance. Pelvic health exercises can be done in any position but most women want to start with standing or they want to start with sitting and they may be too weak to start in those positions so I believe we can start in a semi-inclined position. I don't like the flat position, but women can do these exercises in bed. That's okay in the beginning and then gradually going to a more progressive, working against gravity and that makes the pelvic floor exercise even more challenging.

Isa Herrera:
So, if you start your exercises in sitting and standing, and you can't feel anything, then my recommendation is one, make sure you're doing the pelvic floor exercise correctly by, one, observing the perineum and then test yourself to see what's actually going on inside the vagina. Who else is going to know but you? Why do we outsource our pelvic health all the time when we could have so much more control over it-

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Absolutely.

Isa Herrera:
... if we just knew how to test, how to figure it out, so that we can have this really deep conversation with our caregivers?

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Also, let's talk about that perfect Kegel again. Run through it again for us. First thing is, yoga for the pelvic floor. That exhalation, inhalation, stretching out the pelvic floor, just letting it relax and stretch. Then you talked about, bend over ... What was it? The bend ...

Isa Herrera:
[crosstalk 00:15:43]. Yeah, the clitoral knot. Knots to the queen because my whole tribe is called the super star queens, so I call this the queen knot, the perineal body moves up and in and the anus winks and if you take out a mirror, I mean, it is surprising. When I first started doing it, I was doing it all wrong. I was using my glutes. I was tightening my inner thighs. I was working for dear life and already my body was telling me, "This is not for you." But I wouldn't listen because I'm following the instructions to go home and do Kegels instead of working on the scar tissue that I had and instead of elongating my muscles. And so, it took me so much long to bring myself back to harmony. So much suffering, and so much pain and the leaking and the embarrassment and the shame.

Isa Herrera:
I think if I had this information, so grateful for this live with you because we're bringing this information that is not readily known to all women and this is part of pelvic health 101. They should be teaching this in school to our young girls instead of the sex ed now. My daughter just had sex ed and she came home and she was like ... She's my daughter, so she's read all my books, and she goes, "Ma, you are not going to believe what they taught me." And I'm like, "Well, I'm curious. I want to know. I want to know." And it was just about abstinence, still the same thing. Nothing about the body, very little information, and I live in New York City.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah, well, let's talk about that a second because so many moms raising kids. What do we want to teach them? I have four daughters so I've gone through the gamut.

Isa Herrera:
Oh, so you know.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah, and I've taught sex ed in school, at the local. I'm like, how much do I share? What all do they need to know? These girls are starting their cycles and all at different stages of development, some very underdeveloped, some over-developed, you've got this whole range. It's like okay, that whole concept of ... I say this in sexual CPR in my webinar that I give, help doctors, you know, my sex drive has no pulse, so we talk about the ABCs of sexual health. Right? Acceptance, accepting where we are right now, be present and C, communicate. I think that step A is just that acceptance of our different bodies, our unique bodies and just understanding these are the stages of development. So, what have you taught your daughter? Tell me.

Isa Herrera:
Well, the first thing that I told my daughter was her unique anatomy. It's very funny because my daughter came up to me and said, "Hey, listen, one of the girls in school didn't know what her clitoris was and she's 16 years old and she didn't know where the urine came out of." My daughter was flabbergasted. I started by explaining, first of all, her unique anatomy, so she knew all the different parts. I explained to her what a pelvic exercise was, I explained to her about relaxation, I explained to her that her body is her temple and it's unique to her, that no one looks like her and she should never compare herself to another woman or another pelvic area. I wanted her to know that we are so unique that even our lady parts look different from anybody else. It's like a fingerprint. No two look alike.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
I say like flowers, you know? Like the orchid, right? I always compare the vulva to the orchid and so each orchid is different and beautiful in its own right, so not to compare. I think that's a big issue that at all ages we have with, right? Comparing ourselves to other people and especially at this vulnerable time period, adolescence.

Isa Herrera:
I know.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
You just want to hug them and tell them they're beautiful and precious and unique and to honor that. Because I've had 20-year-olds come to me with gynecologic concerns of their vulvas being different. One's longer than the other, one breast is bigger than the other. I'm like, "Okay, that's normal. Good for you. You're normal. Honor that normalcy." And that's okay, and that these things tend to even out over time as well, so be patient with your body. And then also, just thinking about too, when one side's off from another is just the whole pelvic floor rehabilitation, PowerPractic or osteopathic manipulation. Let's get our nervous system in line because sometimes those are just signs that something's off balance that needs to be improved upon too.

Isa Herrera:
Totally.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
It's a beautiful time period and that your daughter is blessed to have you talking to her about this because you're right. It's bringing up the words and the language around it and also the sacredness of our individuality as well.

Isa Herrera:
Totally and in the beginning I was like, I'm a pelvic floor therapist, I've treated over 14,000 women and seen over 52,000 and when it came to my daughter, I was actually shaking. I was so nervous I was sweating. I was like ...

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
I'm so glad to hear you say that. Oh yeah, I tell you, right? Isa as a pelvic floor therapist and me as a gynecologist and sexual health expert have had some, "How do I go about this in a very holistic, honoring way for my child, that she gets it, honors it and knows that she can communicate and ask questions?" If there's something you can ask ... I have one daughter, she's open about everything. I'm like, "You don't have to be that open with me [crosstalk 00:21:19]."

Isa Herrera:
Yeah, exactly.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
And one who's very closed mouth about all of this, so it's very interesting, so honoring their individuality as well as communicating with them how precious the are and just also in today's day and age. It's like, what we need to know about that, and that will go into another sex ed for teen talk that I really think we should do.

Isa Herrera:
Oh, 100%. I think we should definitely do something like that because it's so needed. It's so needed because women come to me day in and day out. They say, "I don't like my vagina. I hate my vaginal lips. Look at this, look at that." And then I look at them and I'm like, "This is completely normal. There's nothing absolutely wrong with the way you look." And then it breaks my heart because it eats me up inside them. It makes them feel less confident about themselves and then in my programs, I do a live gynecological explanation of the privates because I'm like, nobody knows what the parts are. I hear it all the time.

Isa Herrera:
And so the first thing I do is I just take out a mirror and say, "This is it, this is completely normal. You're good. Everything is fine." It does an asymmetrical thing as you typically do to something happening on the outside, an orthopedic issue. The pelvis is off, too much tension, whatever neural tension, you name it. Then they're like, "Oh, okay." I feel like that's the beginning of healing, like you said.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah. Oh, accepting.

Isa Herrera:
Acceptance is the beginning of healing. It really is.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah, it is, and again, not to ... When it comes to, what are we comparing the images that the kids sadly are seeing and being exposed to early on, it's not realistic. And again, to understand everyone's unique and best to not do any intervention is better than intervention in 99.999% of the cases.

Isa Herrera:
Oh, for sure. So many women come to be after these vaginoplasties because they've had shame and embarrassment around their lady parts, and I'm like, "Oh my god, now we got to deal with the scar tissue. Now we got to deal with nervous tension." It creates a whole big huge mess and they feel like when they get these surgeries, that everything's going to be perfect. They're going to look perfect. Everything's going to be perfect. But that's not always the case. It is major surgery. I've treated a lot of that in that past couple of years. I'm like, well, what's done is done. We just move forward but if we can start to have this conversation early on, that it is our unique anatomy, that we're perfect for ourselves.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Absolutely. Honor it, respect it, like with anything. I think that's the starting point for a good foundation in our self-confidence and just accepting where we are right now, focusing on what's good, and also again, let's not compare. That's for sure a really big downfall. No intervention is better. Again, do no harm. Right? That's our goal. That's our goal in the medical profession for sure. It's do no harm, so the education piece is part of that prevention.

Isa Herrera:
It really is, you know? And I recently took my daughter to the doctor and you know, one day at a certain age they do these exams. But she was totally comfortable with it. I was like, I'm the one who's squeamish. I'm the one that's like, "Wait, no, no, no, nope. Not doing that. Nope, not doing that. No." You know? I was like, okay. I had to take my own stuff out of it, and be like, "All right, this is good, okay. We're going to do this examination, everything ... We're just going to see. This is the first time. Everything is cool. You're perfect." And she was like, "I know, mommy." And I was like, "Oh, okay. You don't need me anymore."

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
I think that's amazing. I say you know, again, I definitely entered the field of gynecology because it was something I was very uncomfortable and I felt was ... needed more women in the field. How do we make people having these ... trusting in a physician to be as comfortable as possible and feel safe and know that they're being taken care of. And you know, I think that's really important that we're creating these programs, and we have this for women of all ages. That has that healing potential at any age, because so many have suffered through unhealthy experiences. So, Isa, tell us where people can get more of you and get in contact with you, and also, we are offering them the Kegel blueprint as a gift, and so we'll be posting that in our show notes here.

Isa Herrera:
Well, definitely for the legal blueprint, go to pelvicpainrelief.com/dranna. She wants you guys to have this gift and it's my pleasure to provide this gift on what the perfect pelvic floor exercise looks like and then if you want to get in contact with me, always go to my website, pelvicpainrelief.com. There you'll find tons of information, beautiful blogs, anything that you want to know is in all those different kinds of pages so that's really, really amazing. That's how they can get into contact with me. And you can always buy one of my books, if you want [inaudible 00:26:42] a book. You know? [crosstalk 00:26:43]-

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Tell us some of the titles of your books, Isa.

Isa Herrera:
I have one called Ending Female Pain and then the other one is Female Pelvic Alchemy, and that one is the accompaniment of my online program for pelvic healing, so they go together in a way. They're sort of like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. And then I created one for pregnancy because all the pregnant women started coming to me. I'm like, what do I do here now? You know? Not everybody can get to me in New York City so I created Ending Pain in Pregnancy. I love that book so much. Female Pelvic Alchemy is great for restoring pelvic health in a natural way. All the books are actually, all of them.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Yeah. Yeah, and I think again, there's many ways to come at it, right? Like working in menopause too with pelvic strengthening exercises and relaxation exercises, both have its place. Like we said, we want yoga. We want stretching and flexibility and high intensity, right?

Isa Herrera:
Absolutely.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
There's a combination for both and then also the right nutrients, so big ... The right nutrients, inside out.

Isa Herrera:
100%.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
From the inside out and the outside in. That makes a difference and again, so many women struggle with pelvic pain so I'm so glad you're out there and you're available to help everyone, Isa.

Isa Herrera:
Thank you.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
As a great resource, I appreciate you and thank you so much for spending time with me today and thank you of all our listeners. I look forward to your interaction, question. You know how valuable this information is. It's invaluable information and for a wide spectrum. So, please be sure to share this, and like us on Facebook and iTunes, and share this message with your friends as well. We appreciate you.

Isa Herrera:
Thank you, Dr. Anna for having me. Just so thrilled to be here.

Dr. Anna Cabeca:
Thank you.

Isa Herrera:
We're just going to help so many women together.

Anna Cabeca
Anna Cabeca

Anna Cabeca, D.O., FACOG, ABOIM, ABAARM